EMBRACING CANCER, Connection, Life, Death and Faith with Lee McCormick - Bytes of Light
Join us as Lee and Angel share how they met, the medicine they shared in Teotihuacan and Peru and Lee's new journey, walking with the Angel of Death as he embraces his experience with cancer. He shares his shamanic perspective and how he is navigating life now.
Lee McCormick, a Florida native, grew up visiting his family’s ranch in Wyoming—an experience that shaped his future. He began pursuing his undergraduate degree at Fort Lewis College in Colorado, before finishing at Belmont University in Nashville. After his own recovery experience, his interest in behavioral health led him to found several residential-based treatment experiences, including The Ranch Recovery Center in Nunnelly, Tennessee, and The Canyon Treatment Center in Malibu, California.
Throughout the 20+ years that Lee has worked in spiritual-based recovery, he’s written several books and produced a documentary called Dreaming Heaven. His passion led him to host workshops and trainings, and facilitate groups for mental health and addictions treatment centers around the country. He co-founded the Integrative Life Center in 2010, a place where people could come to receive individualized treatment rooted in the real world. His entire life’s work has been devoted to empowering people to harness the power of self-discovery and the natural world.
Lee McCormick went on journeys for his own seeking, growth, and healing, spending years learning and co-teaching before leading journeys of his own. Through Spirit Recovery, Lee takes seekers on journeys to recover their authenticity—teaching them how to expand beyond their limiting beliefs, and how to “de-program,” returning to a state of true freedom, love, and happiness. Spirit Recovery journeys are the first step in coming back to a simpler, deeper way of living.
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[Episode Transcription]
 Hello. Hello, Lee. Thank you so much for joining me. I am so excited to have a little conversation with you.
Well, I am too actually.
Yay. I know. It's, it's gonna be great. We'll try to stay on topic, but you know how it goes. We'll see where we go with this. Yeah. So I got it. Download to write. A book about evolving leadership and of course, having you in my life for the last almost four years, three or four years, however long it's been you were at the front and center in my mind of collaborating with, and I.
To have you in my life over this last couple of years has been such an honor and a privilege that the teachings that you've passed on and the amazing journeys that I've got to experience with you has forever changed my life and,
and we've had a lot of fun. And we've had
so much fun and, and that's the biggest.
Takeaway. Honestly for me, when we came home from Peru last year the title for my podcast, my book, my, my mission moving forward was Bites of Light, you know, and that, that came to me when we were integrating our trip from Peru. So to have you still want to play in this storyline is just so exciting
for me.
Well, I, I, when I first heard that title, I thought that that's like a really cool title, right? Yeah. So, so yeah. Either way, however you want to spell bites, it totally works.
Exactly. And that's what I love about it because even when people spell it the other way, it still has meaning to what we're doing. So I just love it.
I just love it so much. And it is all about love and light and, and like you said, playing. And that was one of the things that made me know that I wanted to work with you. You know, that very first time that we shared space in Tao I was going through a bunch of grief and there was one specific moment that's kind of ingrained in my head forever, that you were standing in the parking lot in the dreaming house with your arms open wide, and you said, there's always more love here.
And it was just like, that was it for me, right?
Yeah.
Yeah, because that had not been my experiences in the past, and so when you said that that was hook, line, and sinker for me, I'm like this, this guy's the real deal. Like thank you. Thank you for showing up and holding that space. Right. It was just, that was it for me.
So to still be able to come and play with you and, you know, see what else we get to do together is just, it's just such an honor for me. And when I asked you to write the Forward for our book, which you so graciously did I didn't know at that time that you were going through your own experience and.
You know, literally holding hands with the angel of death and having your own adventure on the side. And so for you to take the time, your time and your attention and bring some of your energy into this book and provide light codes for it, I just thank you so
much. Yeah, well you're super welcome. And you know what?
The being creative and the being able to contribute and participate is like, that's the point. Right. You know? And at the same time, this, this journey that I'm in now, it makes it, it, it leaves me very, very conscious of there is limited. Time limited attention and limited energy, because that's, that's been the main thing that I've been dealing with the last few months, is that I don't have this kind of endless energy that I've always had.
Right. Right. And I'm responsible for where I direct my energy. And so, you know, clearly the most important, the the most important place for my energy is in taking care of myself. Of course. But anyhow, that was, I mean, that was easy, right? Writing that for you. So you're, you're welcome. And I, you know, I appreciate being asked to do that.
I'm always, I'm still always humbled and kind of surprised when people say, will you write something for my book? I'm like, really?
Yeah. Come on, be. That's my daughter. My daughter's on her way to see Taylor Swift tonight. Yay.
Oh, I've seen her. It's awesome. She's gonna have a great time.
Yeah, she is. That's great. So yeah, so life goes on. Life
goes on. Well I am, you know, goodness knows you and I love to fly. And, you know, I would love to kind of do an eagle's eye view of, you know, your past and for the listeners who may not know who you are and you know, if you're okay with that.
I think it might be kind of fun to just do a little just do a little recap of who you are and how you came to be, where you're at right now in this
moment. Yeah. Take a pause one second. Bye, baby.
Okay. Yes. Why don't you,
yeah, I, I left some space so that we can cut that. We're all good. Edit. I have a great editor, so my son.
All right. So why don't you tell us what was your earliest memory of life like when you first came onto this planet? One of, what's one of the first things that you, that kind of stuck with you?
Okay. Grief. You know, I like, I don't remember things. We, I remember specific situations sometimes. Yeah. But, I more often remember the, like, the bubble that I was in in different points in life.
And my family was very tribal. I guess. You know, my, it was a, we had a family owned construction company. There were a couple hundred employees in that company. We had a big farm that had been in the family since 18 hundreds in Florida. So we hunted and fished together and ran cows on that place and everybody worked together in the construction world when I was a little kid.
And so I think my earliest memories or the earliest imprints on me was that, like that tribe. That, that big family that, that you live and you work and you play and you like, you, you're all in it together. And that's, that's really been, that's been the way I connect to life all my life. I've never been, I've been a solo person to a degree and that I see things.
Uniquely, and I think I figured that out right fairly early on, that I just see things differently. But I love connection and I love community. Awesome.
And you know, as you were growing up in your childhood you know, we, you and I have studied the four agreements, extens extensively. Yeah. And from from your family unit when you were younger, what were s what was one of the agreements that you chose to keep, you know, you talked about that tribe piece was what, what, what else would you say would be one of the agreements that, that was the gold of your family?
Probably always do your best. Mm-hmm. Or you know, yeah. Because. Not making assumptions is something that that to me that's like a higher degree of awareness. The realization of that I need to be asking questions, not assuming things but always do your best. Was was almost like a mantra among the crew, you know, among my, my family.
But it was not always do your best without the judgment. Right?
Yeah, yeah. Judgment is a thing. And that, that actually leads right into the next question. Like if what, what one of the agreements, and it doesn't have to be those four specific just agreements, con, conscious or unconscious. Which ones do you feel that you evolved?
Through time, through your childhood into your teenage years?
Well, getting into teenage years, I was, I was pretty rebellious. So I don't think I could really say that, that the context of the four agreements would've applied a whole lot in my life cuz it was pretty much, I want to do what I want to do.
And if you don't like it I'll go somewhere else and do it right. You know, so I mean that and that teenage rebellion is natural. In fact, I think the older I've gotten and the, the, over the years of working with people and realizing the depth of the nature of our culture and all this stuff it puts on us, I'm kind of surprised that kids are not more rebellious than they are.
Right. You know, you know, I don't know my life got be because of the nature of the way we're domesticated using the language. My life was pretty reactive to a degree. And also you could say that I was self-centered, but the truth was, it was self-preservation, trying to keep. Who I am apart from all of the, the energy and the relationships and the demands that would've just swallowed me.
You know, cuz there was a whole plan for who I should be and what I my life should look like as a kid. Right, right. Yeah.
What would you say to him now, pardon me? That, that, that teenager inside, what would you say to him now? What advice would you give him now?
You, you don't have to believe them. It's that simple.
You can listen. Yeah. And you can hear and understand that, that they're doing their best. And they haven't had many choices and what, what they have come to believe not really. And so, There's nothing to be gained by going to war. Right. With the world of opinions. And you just don't need to believe it.
Be cool and be responsible for yourself.
That's amazing. What what do you feel that you were most proud of him for back then?
Oh gosh. You know, my mom and my dad both. I kind of, I grew up, my parents got divorced when I was 12 and my mom a couple years later, married a man that I had also known all my life that I ended up being partners with in the cattle business for years.
So it was kind of a, there was my mom and then there was my dad, my blood dad that I was very close to. And there was also my stepdad. They were, they were extremely strong-willed, very direct, took no prisoners. If you got in their way, you would have to deal with them kind of people. And so I, I guess I adopted that kind of attitude that if I really believe something needs to be done a particular way, then that's what I'm gonna do my best to do.
So, you know, a tenacity, a a focus, a, a willfulness as such, you know, to pursue the things that I believe to be correct.
That, that, that epic warrior that lies within you was built then.
Yeah. Yeah. I, I could have used a little less. Warring and a little more smarts at how I approach them. But
isn't that part of the practice?
Isn't that how you learn?
Oh yeah, it's right. It is. Yeah. I mean, you know, as you've heard me say before, our, our sufferings and our misery are really the, the integrity of life trying to get us to pay attention. Right. They're not curses, they're blessings inviting us to pay attention. Right.
Yeah. It's amazing.
Yeah. And. You and I met on sacred Ground in March, 2020, just as Covid decided to bless this planet, right? And what an incredible time to meet you, right? The whole world is going through this collective spiritual death, and we are doing ceremony in the pyramids. Yeah. I, I, I sometimes wonder like, we can't make this shit up, right?
Yeah. And, but we do. It's sig, right?
Yeah. And that was such a significant, pivotal moment in my life, and as I'm sure for everybody but I always, because I, I didn't even know anything about you until that journey. You know, I, I knew who you were and that you were a teacher and that was it, literally.
And so going from that teenager that we just talked about and the lessons and building the warrior to you standing on those grounds going, there's more love here. Like, how the hell did that happen? Like the umbrella view, how did, how did you go from that to that? Because talk about extreme
Yeah. It's timelines, right? It's a big shift. It is a big shift. And I'd love to see an, an eagle's eye view of of, of how that happened.
Well, it didn't happen easily, right? Right.
Carol's journey is never easy,
Lee. Yeah. Well, I, you know, I, I went to Taylor the first time in, I think 2000, 2000 maybe. And I think I went back two or three times a year, every year since then, if not more.
Right. And so there was something about the energy and the integrity of that place. That was undeniable to me. I felt at home there, I felt compelled to be there. Of course, I, you know, I really respected Miguel and, and the old crew and all the original teachers and all that. And at the same time that was, that was happening in one dimension.
But the pull and the connection to what's embodied in Tao was an other much bigger dimension, and I didn't understand it, but I was drawn to it anyway. So that was the beginning of me realizing that I don't have to figure something out in order to step into it. To honor how it feels, if it really feels correct, I don't need to understand it.
I don't need to figure it out. I need to just step into it and allow myself to be taught or allow more to be revealed. And Tao had such a powerful effect on me in the way that it magnifies whatever we're carrying, right. So I couldn't get away from myself. There, you know, and that, that's a big gift.
Like everywhere you turn, there you are. And it was, well, it was about love. Ultimately. It was not about love. And the first five or six or seven or eight years of my relationship there, it was about dismantling. Yeah. You know, the, the love talk was almost a distraction because I was like, there was so much, I carried so much energy in me that didn't serve me.
That was all inherited, being born into this world, right? I mean, no victim, it just is what it is. Yeah. That's, that's
life on earth, right?
Yeah. That the first order of business was to come to terms with, with, who is it? I believe I am, and what am I doing here? Right. You know, the old who am I really? And that took a lot of time and a lot of work, you know, a lot of attention and willingness.
And the willingness to real, to to realize after a few years of being in and out of Tao, realizing that I was not gonna find answers. In the way that I had been taught to seek answers, which is knowledge will answer and fix everything. It was it was not about collecting the correct knowledge. It was about allowing the experiences to come through me that would wake me up from the inside out.
And that's, you know, that's still my experience here. The last time I was there last fall was I mean it was every bit as powerful as, as the first time I was there, 20 something years ago. Cuz it, there's always another dimension, right? There's always another realization. And in fact, the way I held tete waan and the energy and the entities and the, the gods, if you want to, the energies that some people call Gods, that I have relationships with their.
That entire fabric completely flipped on its head last summer during a journey there. So the entire context changed that tete Wcan was not presided over by a male energy. The tete waan, the essence of it and the power of it is held in the feminine and the feminine bestowed the power to the males. Yes.
That the males. The males did not have the ability to summon the power that the feminine is the master of. And so it turned it all upside down. It's it Lala and Kek and you know, on and on that the true power of that place is in the heart of the feminine. Great. And that was profound. And that's also, that also became, A huge relief.
Yep. The polls are
balancing. Yeah. Well, because like I've felt for a long time, if the future of humanity is dependent upon the men to sort it out, we're pretty much screwed. Yeah. Because the men, the males, have been doing the best we could do for a long time, and this is the best we can do. Right. And it's a mess.
And it's time for the women to step up and own the portals that they are.
Yeah. Well, it's time for, you know, as the, as, as all of us are responsible to evolve beyond the state that we find ourself in. When we begin to wake up, we're responsible to. To outgrow the ways of being and thinking and believing that we wake up with.
And so the women have a great responsibility to evolve beyond where the women are at today, right? Absolutely. Just as the men do.
Absolutely. Yeah. They're just as wounded, you know, both, both sides are wounded,
you know, and, and I think that's in their, in our own unique ways.
Yeah. And that's part of our, our, our mission down here is, you know, earth is school.
Yeah. We we're trying to remember who we are and, and you know, the power that we do house
and Well, and it's the, it's, if it's anything, I believe it's the birth of a new paradigm of, of Yes. The way we live in the world. And what I know of because I've been trying to, to bring in new paradigms in the mental health addictions treatment world for 20 years.
Well, the thing about the birth of a new paradigm is you have no idea what it's gonna look like or feel like or how it's gonna operate when you begin to dream it. And the tendency is that we always revert back to what we know because there's a familiarity and a comfort to being surrounded by what we know or using our existing belief system to draw from and all that stuff.
Mm-hmm. But what we end up ultimately doing is just recreating another version of the same thing. That we've already known, that we say we're trying to, to move forward from. Mm-hmm. Does that make sense? Yeah.
For me, how I translate that is you know, I take it into the, the gym context is, you know, you, you go and you build your, your physical muscles and.
We have to also build our spiritual muscles. So you're right, we get up into these higher states of consciousness, and then we bring this, this, you know, we get these downloads and this beautiful medicine to share with the world. And then, you know, you get your, your attention gets hooked by something and then you start creating down in that vibration instead of holding the vibration.
So there is this need to keep working the spiritual muscles so that you can maintain that vibration. Instead of dropping back and down and doing this rollercoaster thing that a lot of people do Well, we all do. We all
do. Yeah. Well's discovering it, it's, it's us discovering within ourself and coming into a relationship within ourself in relation to the unknown in like, it'd be like, You know, you show up, there's a balance beam and somebody says, okay, I'm gonna give you all the information on how to do this exercise.
And just with the information, you're gonna hop up there and do the exercise. Will you hop? Yeah. Have fun with that, your ass right? It doesn't work. Yeah. So, but, and it's the unknown because first time, I mean, I'm not a gymnast, but I can only imagine the first time you get on a balance beam, you're like, okay, I have no idea what I'm doing here.
I'm gonna kill myself. I gotta go
that and, and that was my world for 30 years.
Yeah, so, so where is your faith in those moments of stepping into something that is completely unknown to you and yet you're gonna step into it with your heart open, with your, with your mind, as open as it can be, and with that fear with you, but the fear you have to keep putting the fear behind you if you're gonna step forward.
Well, that's the way I see where we're at in this world today.
Yeah. And, and I do think that's why some athletes, especially, you know, ones that do sports like gymnastics or, or you know, the, the the high risk sport is, you know, every time my national athletes stepped onto the trampoline and are jumping 25 feet in the air, learning a new skill, you know, there's a risk of death period.
Like that's, that's not. Willy-nilly stuff like we're talking life and death situations here, and they're choosing to do it. So then when you ask people who don't have that kind of training to walk through their fear, it's like,
Yeah. Well then it's the same thing when we step into a path of, you know, I'm miserable.
I, I, I don't like my life, I don't like myself. And I want to live something else. Well, you have absolutely no idea what that something else is gonna look like or feel like. There's no way to know because you have no reference point with it. That's
right. You just gotta go in. Yeah. Commit. Commit to that.
Commit to that new storyline.
And at the same time we come to realize like, If we follow the same pattern that's already established within us is, okay, well I'm gonna take all these new experiences and weave me a new belief system and then I'm gonna attach to that belief system and I'm gonna wear white and I'm gonna do, I'm gonna walk this way, you know, and I'm gonna get all the external aspects of the ceremony down, and that's gonna make it all better.
Well, you've just created another, another externalized. Reality that you've, that you have projected responsibility for ourself onto. And that's not it. It may be improved from where we were, which is great, but it's, it's the same way of, of engaging life that we have been engaging all along.
Now you just got a white
dress on.
Yeah. And, and it is an improvement, you know, sometimes you, yes. You meet people where they're at, we begin at the beginning and these little steps are fantastic. And it's really important as teachers, I take or as guides to monitor where people are at so they have a sense of comfort. Yes. So they can relax, learn to be relaxed, and at the same time, remind them, be very conscientious of what you're attaching yourself to.
Because attachments are not actually security. They're islands of safety. Yep.
Truth. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Can you remember when there your, one of your significant. Spiritual awakening experiences that that kind of went, yeah, this is where I need to be. Like why tail and, and why keep going back? Something significant must have happened that calling way back in the beginning when you first win.
It was, it was the energy you know, I'm not so much anymore, but I was just a big energy junkie for a long time cuz I could go there and blast off. Right. It was the first place, first time I ever had the experience of, as we say, leaving your body. Except I've never completely left my body. I'm always conscious of my body, but I can go completely into the light.
Yes. At the same time. But that first experience of going into the light. And realizing that I was so, I was completely at home there, and it was so still and, and so just, it was, it was heaven if, you know, we use that word heaven. It was so powerful for me and I knew that that was the truth. Like I knew I couldn't define it.
It doesn't have a street address. And I also knew because I had listened to Miguel say this a million times, that these experiences that we're having are happening within us. So don't give the experience away to the pyramid. Don't give the experience away to the mushroom or the ayahuasca because you're not capable of experiencing anything that is not already in some regard contained within.
Who you are. Really? Absolutely. Yeah. Oh, I realized that space and the light was an aspect of myself and I just wanted to keep going back there. And, and I've made a practice of that. And it's, it's like we say in the sweat lodge in Lakota, you say, all my relations, you know, that's, that's one of the, one of the statements of ceremony when you're stepping into ceremony.
All my relations are there for real. Yeah. And, and most of it, there's no identity to it. It's a presence. So having, having access to that has, it's been really important this last few months since I've been, since I've been living where this cancer thing and, and you know, what is my faith really? And.
I just, I go out and sit in the sun and put my face to the sun and phew. I go there. How'd you go? Yeah. And that's why the, the bites of light, like I'm literally eating light every day. Yes. You know, and I'm like, I don't know if I'm gonna stay in my body or not. I think I am. I think I'm gonna be here for, for some time longer, but if I'm checking outta my body, I'm okay with that too, cuz I have no fear whatsoever.
Of what comes after being here. Right.
Well, and that's a perfect segue because I was curious if you, when did you start, when did you start to question what was happening in your body? What were your hits? How did you know to go and get checked out?
Last false trip to Peru. Ah, so you were on the spring trip?
I was on the spring trip, yep. Yeah. So, you know, I went back last October while I was laying on the bed at, in order baba at the typic collar, and I put my hand on my abdomen and it just felt hard. It was like, it, it felt weird and so intuitively, I, I just, I knew that's not right, like something's up. So I came home after that and called our doctor.
And they've, they just said, you're so freaking healthy. You know, it's probably, it's probably a, a, I don't, they, they just said you, whatever. So yeah, they got an ultrasound and there was a mass and then they ordered a ct. When I got the ct, they saw the two tumors. You know, and it's like immediately you're a hundred percent human when that happens.
You're not some enlightened, groovy, freaking dude. Yeah, you're a hundred percent human. You've got four daughters. You know, I've got my wife that I love with all my heart. I've got everything in the world that I love, and all of a sudden the angel of death is like, yeah. Well, I hope you've enjoyed it. Hi, here I am.
How are you doing
today? But it immediately became a journey. And, you know, yeah. There's emotion involved in that. I can't, there was never fear, there was sadness, right? The idea of leaving my girls was really, really deep seated sadness. But I was never afraid, which I thought was weird, you know? I kept thinking, I'm gonna, I'm gonna be afraid.
And I'm like, I'm not afraid. I don't want to go anywhere, but I'm not afraid. And I attribute that to the way I've lived the last,
I was gonna say, with all the training and, and your experiences and your capacity to even astral travel, that changes everything. That changes everything. And it changes your relationship with life and death.
It does. It does. And you know, probably the greatest gift. Well, there've been so many gifts have come out of this and continue to be revealed. But maybe the greatest gift is I realized like how much I love so many little aspects of life that I never even considered that I loved, that you know, that I, that I love the fe, the smell of, of.
Cut hay. I love hearing the birds start chirping in the morning. You know, like all those things, I've appreciated them, but I realized, God, there's just, there's this whole fabric of life and I really love it. Yeah. You know, I don't want to clinging to it or possess it, but I love it and I appreciate it.
No, you're allowed to
dance and mingle and merge with it and play Right. It, it's not a no. It's not a fear attachment. It's it's life and, and
you can tell well, and it's sweetness. It's sweetness. All the sweetness. You've deepened your awareness. Yeah, it, and it just cleared the slate of I'm not, I'm not too busy to feel all those acknowledgements and connections.
Like that's what happens every day. Everywhere I go now, that's what I'm experiencing. I can be busy in my head and working on something and that does not override. Me seeing the cardinal that just landed on the bush and looked at me, right? I'm not too busy for all those little things. So it shifted that, it shifted the level of, of how I witnessed.
And I think it, that's what being in this space did, it really fine tuned how I, how I see and feel, everything going on around me. So, which is cool, those
experience. Yeah. That shifted within, I, we all know, like you said, when you know, it starts with self first and you're experiencing these deep internal shifts and this expanded awareness with the world, how, how has this experience shifted with the people that are closest to you with your relationships?
Well, it scares and it still does. Like my daughters are, they're scared, of course, you know? And my wife is, you know, Mimi's like, I don't know how I'll be in this world without you. So, and that, that I regret because my, my situation has brought that fear to them. And, and that bothers me. It's like I would never, ever do anything to bring that kind of fear and sadness into their life.
And it is life. So, I mean, I'm not, you know, I don't feel guilty about it or anything, but it just, it bothers me that, that that's one of the effects that this has had on them. You know, but I also. But I've kind of been this way for a while cuz I was fortunate enough to have two families, right? I've got a, I've got a 40 year old daughter, a 36 year old daughter, a 20 year old daughter, and a 16 year old daughter, two different marriages.
So I got to raise families two different times and realized the difference in the space I was in. Both times being a dad. So it's like life really blessed me with the opportunity to, to give all the love and grace that myself absorbed first time around and everything was about me and being a man and all that bullshit that, that I missed on the first time because I was so busy trying to be the role plays that I believed I had to be in order to be.
Successful. Right. Well, the second time, that's not happened. Right. But yeah, it's, and it's made my time with, it's made my time with all my daughters and my grandkids and Mimi just that much more precious. It's, you know, and with my friends, like being back in Tao, being with Alberto and Veronica, they're my family.
Yeah. You know, Jorge's family. Yeah. Like again, it's, I love, like, I'm so in love with the beauty and the, the mystery of life that I just, I don't wanna miss a second, but I live on this energetic rollercoaster where I feel good half the time and I could get out, run around and do things, and then all of a sudden my energy crashes.
And I'm going against myself if I don't just go lay down and rest because I have to take care of my physical body first. You know? So it's making, it's making peace in general. Yeah. It's making peace with that. Yes. I'm very at peace with it. Yeah.
Yeah, yeah. There are so many lessons that, that these kind of things bring to humans and I love that.
You know, you, you're shifting and, and creating that awareness and, and the relationships around you bringing them in closer. If, if you had an opportunity to sit with some people and give them some wisdom that you feel would help them in the initial part of finding out that they have a life-threatening illness, what would you say to them?
Oh God, I
Just be with your heart, you know, listen to your heart. Trust your heart. Trust your, your spirit. You know, I, I don't know. I, that, that's a tough question because it, it's so personal. It's so personal. And again, I'm really fortunate cuz I've spent over 20 years clearing out all my old, all the old programming grievances and angry shit and all that stuff.
Like I don't have any of that. Yeah. You know,
I know for me it was really, and you did and you did touch on it, that listening to your body, meeting yourself where you're at and you know, if we go back to the beginning of this interview, like even coming to the four agreement, always do your best. Because your best is different every single day.
Yeah. You know, when I had my bacterial infection, it was the same thing. My body was trying to heal itself, which meant I had to get my mind out of the way and let my body heal itself.
Well, one thing I will say about literally the, the physical part of the, of medical treatment, right, is really trust your intuition in that, because I started.
At a, at a, with Tennessee Oncology and at a hospital here that I have friends that are, that are MDs there connected to an oncologist, connected to a whole network, and spent the first month in that process. Then a friend of mine in Florida who is an integrative oncologist, I was talking to him about it and he said, brother, you need to come to Mayo.
He said it's the number one liver cancer treatment facility in the world. I don't work there. He works for shs, for University of Florida Hospital. He said, but they're the best. And, and I'm friends with one of the main docs there, and I'll make that connection. Well, that was a universe. That was life.
Yeah. You know, and I immediately, You feel guilty because you've connected to these other doctors, right? And when I went and spoke to the, the lead oncologist here in Nashville and told him about Mayo, he looked right at me and said, if I was you, I would do exactly the same thing, you know? And so it's not a time to be
a fixer pleaser, right?
You have to take care of
yourself, right? And, and you, and even though there is fear, don't be in the fear. Hold yourself for the solution and keep asking. For help to guide you in the solution. Yeah. You know, whatever that looks like. Which it applies in life in general. That same approach applies to anything in life.
And it's challenging for a lot of us to trust our intuition unless you've been living that already. Exactly. You know, I mean, that's, that's. That's probably as big an encouragement as there is for doing the work for yourself and taking care of yourself and, and eating little bites, a light, you know, and, and doing the kind of things that we, we've all done together for years is that it allows us to actually have that direct connection to spirit.
Exactly.
And everybody's journey is different. Everybody who has these, these things come up in their life to experience. Everybody's gonna do it differently. Like you said, you were in two different medical places and chose, you know, chose to go somewhere else. Yeah. And my partner that passed away a couple of years ago, actually it was, he passed away eight weeks before I met you.
And that's what I was processing in Tao that time was the grief of him leaving the planet. I remember. Yeah. And he also was battling cancer and he choose, he chose to go completely clean. No medical intervention at all. Yeah, they gave him three months to live and he spent four and a half years past that date.
Meditation crystal work. Plant medicine, mushroom.
Yeah, there's many paths.
Right? And that was how he chose. And it didn't matter. His kids were not okay with that. So there was distension in the family, but he knew in his heart that this is what the path that he was supposed to take. And
that's to that.
I'll tell you something about exactly what you're saying is once you've chosen a path, Give it all your faith. That's right. Trust it, love it. Don't be at odds with it. I hear people say, I hate chemo. Chemo sucks. You know, I wish, and I'm like, You want, you want that stuff to help you. You want it to, yeah.
Don't
work against it. If that's what, that's the path you choose.
Right. Why would you want to energetically be at odds with what, what you're hoping is going to heal you? And, and we, we need to work on that because culturally, it's like the whole thing about you gotta fight cancer. I'm like, there's not a fight bone in my body right about this.
I gotta love my way through this. You know, I have to learn and listen and witness and, and ease my way through this so, You know, that's just the way I approach it. I, I don't want to be mad about this.
Well, and that's, that's, we know that love is the most powerful healing force in the planet, you know, and it was ingrained even deeper when we went to Peru.
And the fact that you got to go there twice in the one year. Like I, there was lifesaving medicine there for you.
Yeah. You know, and, and well, that's where I discovered what was going on, you know?
Yeah, mama was speaking.
Yeah. I mean it's, yeah. Peru, Peru, Peru. I'm planning to go back in October. Awesome. The person, the person that does my flyers for me, she said, are you really planning to go to Peru in October with everything that's going on?
I was like, yeah, by October I'll be fine. Yeah. You know, like, and, and it's, it's not arrogance or pushiness. I'm just comfortable with it. It's like, yeah, I need to go back in October cuz I need to be with them. With those what? With the, with the Andes and with the order Bamba. And with the Caros, you know, I want to go be with them.
They're, yeah. They feed my spirit,
right? Yeah. Yeah. I can't wait. I can't wait to go back as well. Yeah. I think everybody should have that opportunity. And we also know once you develop that relationship and you have those initiations, you can access that energy where you are. And like you said, when you go to these power places, it's amplified.
It is,
it is different. It is now there, there's an anchored energetic there. There definitely is. I need to plug my computer up so it doesn't die. Okay. One second.
Okay, boy. No, we're all plugged in. Yeah, we're all good. Sorry about that. No worries.
Yeah, so the intuition piece I think is really important when like I. Yes, in this case, but in general, I think people learning to tap into that space and have their connection, that's where we lead our lives from. That's where we create from, that's where we manifest from.
And getting, well,
it can be, it can be where we do all those things from the, the, you know, the cav, the alternative to that is it's that we're living and creating. From our knowledge base, which is we were domesticated to operate from the mine. And the intuition is that direct link to the spirit, that through domestication we essentially abandon it.
Except for those individuals who is in whose intuitive connection is so strong, they don't abandon it. It doesn't go away. Right. But, but it's like, It's like having, it's like the, our, our intuition is 99 on the FM dial, and we're cranked up to 1 0 4. Right. So we just hear
it.
Yeah. Well, I certainly have cherished our times together.
As far as the, the flying piece, you know, I, I will not ever forget Tela and my first shot off into space. Thank you very much.
Mm-hmm. Those guys, they're my buddies, man. I work. Yeah. Yeah. And they're,
they're, they're pretty wild. And it, it probably took me a good year to integrate that, that one experience.
And, you know, every time we get together, there's always some profound magic that happens. And I am so grateful for your consistency.
And so, remember, remember the feeling leaving the room where you'd been with the eagles and I took you, took everybody out into the sunlight. And said, flap your wings like that.
That's just the, that's the most joyous, wildest, outta control, laughing, feeling I've ever had.
It is, it is. And I remember cuz I was the last one to come back and so I didn't have a lot of integration time before we started doing that. And as I lifted my hands up and I'm watching myself, I, I don't know who I said it to, but I was like who created these soul baskets?
Anyways, they're so weird. I was like, yeah, what the hell Just came
out of my mouth like, well, you see that with little babies. I've noticed this for years and years. You know, little newborns, they're asleep and they're all peaceful and they wake up and they start moving around and it's kinda like, oh my God, where am I?
I'm trapped. Let me go. It's just
wild. Yeah. And so to be able to, you know, experience that, you know, as, as an adult and, you know, go back into that whoa space, you know, there are no words. You know, and you know, it's, it's kind of a double-edged sword when you ask somebody, you know, how, how was your spiritual awakening?
Because when you, when you access those realms, sometimes it's hard to translate into human words. What the hell happened while you
were there? I, well, and you, I think you've heard me say this too. I think there are experiences like that, that are not meant to be talked about, right? I mean, with a very, very select few people that have a relationship with that other dimension because trying to, trying to communicate it to people that don't, you just bleed the energy out.
It's, it's very personal. It's completely universal and initially it's very personal and I think it's important to hold that close. Yeah. Until
it's time. You know, that that is why bites of light was birthed, like that came to me in Peru. Mm-hmm. So, you know, yes and yes. Some is personal and some is meant to be shared, and at some point you decide.
What is what, you know, it's part of the process, I guess.
Yeah, yeah. Well, the sharing comes after a maturation process. Right. You know? Yeah. It comes as, as a result of holding it close and living with it, and then it evolve. It's like planting seeds, right.
Yeah. Well, and I feel like that's what this book has been.
You know, the introduction of the book I'm talking about when I was five years old, walking down the street and even saying that I can physically see myself with my hand on that energetic wolf, you know? And so this book has been 45 years in the making, right? From that first story, right? Mm-hmm. So the seeds are here.
Yeah. And yeah, I, I. What I haven't shared with you yet, so I'm gonna tell you now cuz it's just so cute. At the end of your forward, do you remember when we were in Peru and I took that picture of you and Seth over this photo? Yeah. You know which one I'm talking about? Yeah. And that and then, and then on the way home, I wrote that poem and showed you the poem.
Yeah. I put that picture in the book Underneath your forward.
Oh, that's great. Isn't that exciting? So was that the, I can't, where were we when you took that
picture? I'm trying to
remember the name of it. Oh, yeah. At psac Psac?
No, at where the circles are? The, the, that vortex. Oh, Mariah at Mariah Morai. It was in Mariah.
It was at that Mariah circle. Yeah. And every time I look at that picture, my hair stands up. It's just so incredible. The energy that you guys are holding. There is just like 2, 2, 2 aspects of Archangel Michael standing there with your wings spread out. It's just so incredible. And we literally, this just came in last night.
We, we've got the inside, it's all done and we're, oh, wow. We're doing one more edit. And I was scrolling last night cuz you know, I just can't help myself. I'm just, I'm in bed and it came through and I'm like, oh, I just have to take a quick visual so I can dream into it. I get it. And as I, as I scrolled your forward and then at the end, your last little piece I made like an incantation so it's small and then your picture, your guys' picture came up and I just started crying.
I'm just like, ah, it's so good.
Oh, that's the best. Very cool. Yeah. Well, this is your baby, sweetie. You're gonna love it. I
love it already. I loved it. It, it's funny. And I guess that is the mother way. I loved it before I even saw it in fruition because I knew, I knew it was coming from my bones. I knew it was coming from my soul, and it's gonna be amazing.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm just so happy that you're a part of it. Thank you for sharing your light, your bites of light, your, your unique ray of light. It's just incredible and I cannot wait to share it with the world and the fact that we are birthing it on the summer solstice, there's just so much light packed into this book.
It's just, it's
gonna be great. Yeah, it is. Yeah.
So thank you. Thank you also for coming and sharing your story.
Well, you're welcome. Yeah, you're welcome. Yeah. Yeah. It's good to
see you. It is. It's, it's been a while. It's been a while, and I can't wait to share space with you again soon.
Yeah, we will. We will.
We will. We will,
well, we will close out and know I love you and I hope your journey goes exactly how you want it to go. And I'm sending all my love to your family. And blessings, blessings, blessings.
Well, thank you, sweetie. And give, give Seth a hug for me. I will. Okay. All right. Adios. Adios.
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